Setting Up an Ergonomic and Healthy Lifestyle for Crocheters & Knitters| Podcast Episode #90

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Do you crochet or knit every day?

If so, you’re probably doing a number on your body and you don’t even realize it. I didn’t even realize my passion was causing me pain until I could literally feel it – pain in my shoulders. A few episodes back I shared that story as well as some ways to avoid aches and pains while we crochet. That episode led me to today’s guest, an expert in the physical fitness and wellness world.

Special Guest

I’m so excited to share today’s guest, Elena with you. She is so passionate about health and wellness and you can feel it as she speaks. We started off with the idea that we’ll arm knitters and crocheters with the knowledge they need to be healthy so they can continue their passion but as we got into it, realized that it really requires wellness all around. Elena cares so much about your health and well-being and she pours her knowledge to you on today’s show!

Episode Transcript

Brittany:
Hey there and welcome to episode number 90 of the BHooked podcast. I’m super grateful that you’re here. I know you could be spending your time in so many other ways and hopefully you’re getting some stitch time in as you listen because this is actually going to be one of the longer episodes that we have here on the show. It was one of those chats that was just too good to cut short.

Now, you may remember back in episode 81, I talked all about some of the personal struggles that I’m going through with posture and how that limits me in my craft with knitting and crochet. Well, in that episode, I basically shared a lot of different tips from suggestions within the community of how you can just bring awareness to your posture, take frequent breaks and that sort of thing so that we can continue to do what we love, but not experience some of the pains that can come along with that.

Well, as a result of that show, a real fan of the show and somebody who is a professional in this sort of industry reached out to me personally and said, hey, I want to offer my services for you, my advice, my recommendations. I’m at your disposal. And so I had to take her up on that opportunity.

So I’m joined today by Elena, a health professional who has really devoted her life to helping health and wellness, being the best version of herself. And as a bonus, she’s also a crocheter too. So she can really relate her profession to us as knitters and crocheters. And that’s why, man, it was just one of those wonderful, amazing chats. So I’m super excited to share all of her wisdom with you today.

Before we get into that, though, I want to take a quick moment to thank my sponsor, Red Heart.

So as you know, Red Heart has some new, yummy, squishy yarns for us to try out. And I’ve mentioned this one a couple of times, but it’s definitely worth bringing up again.

Now, do you remember that project that I posted probably four years ago? It was a little project called the Hairpin Lace Infinity Scarf. And let me just say, that project really catapulted me to where I am today. So that Hairpin Lace Infinity Scarf recommended the use of Red Heart Treasure yarn, which was a yarn that I found strolling the aisles of Joann’s and just absolutely fell in love with it.

It’s a variegated yarn that has long sweeping colorways, but it also has some little bits of other fibers or other colors rather that are applied together. And so you get a mix of stripes and some almost like speckling to your stitches.

Well, you may not have heard that Red Heart Treasure was recently discontinued. And as a result, I have been on the market for a yarn that is very comparable to this in terms of the color work. Because, well, that’s what really made that Hairpin Lace Infinity Scarf so amazing.

And, well, I think I found it. And I really hope you can give this yarn a try. It’s called Red Heart Colorscape. It has a similar design, thickness and a similar feel with one exception. I have to say it’s a lot softer than Treasure.

Another benefit to Colorscape over Treasure is that it’s a 100% acrylic yarn. So those of you with allergies or if you know somebody with allergies, this is going to be a great substitute for that project and you don’t have to worry about those wool elements that were in Treasure.

So you can find Red Heart Colorscape at your local craft store as well as see all of the beautiful colorways on redheart.com. Actually, that’s what I would recommend you do. Head over to their website, redheart.com, and then look up Colorscape. I’ll have this linked in the show notes as well so that you can see the 12 different colorways that it’s available in.

Now, it ranges from really bright colors like some bright pinks and yellows, and it goes all the way down to the neutral colors — creams, whites, and grays. I think there’s something for everybody there, and I’m pretty sure you can look forward to a revamp of that Hairpin Lace Infinity Scarf using Colorscape yarn because it’s the perfect substitute.

Okay, now on to today’s show, we talk about a lot of different resources. We cover a range of topics relating it specifically to you as a knitter or as a crocheter, but also on the full spectrum of things — of just health and wellness and being your best self.

So yes, this is a little bit different than what we may have addressed here in the past, where we talk a lot about tactics that could relate to your craft individually, how you might do something or building your business and some tips around that. But we couldn’t do any of those things if our health is suffering.

And that’s why this episode and this chat really resonates with me. And I know it’s why you will connect to it as well. We really can’t be our best self unless we take care of ourself first.

So Elena is here today to share some tips about setting up an ergonomic workstation, and that is relatable to those of us who sit at a computer all day long. I know that covers a lot of us here, but setting up your workstation — and I’m using air quotes there — for when we knit and crochet, because we need to be mindful of how we’re sitting as we’re doing those things.

Because, well, if you’re like me, you get caught up and you lose track of time and maybe you sit there for more than you even realize. Well, I think that’s where a lot of my problems have started because I am really aware about my posture when I’m sitting at my desk, right? Because it’s top of mind.

But when I’m sitting on the couch, I’m relaxing, I’m enjoying my craft. I don’t really think about the fact that maybe my shoulders are rolled forward or that my feet aren’t on the floor. And I think I’ve learned through this conversation that I need to be a little more aware of things like that.

So we cover that right at the start. We go into some tips and strategies about how you can stretch. And because this topic really isn’t covered enough — when you stretch, you also have to strength train so that things work out evenly.

And all of this plays together to keep your joints, your hands, your wrist — all of that — stress to a minimum so that you can continue to do what you love, that you can crochet and knit as long as you want to.

Elena, hi, welcome to the show.

Elena: 8:03
You’re very welcome. I’m happy to be here and share what I can to benefit your audience.

Brittany: 8:08
Well, you’re a real gem because not only are you a crocheter, but you’re in the fitness industry as well. And let me just say, I have been looking for somebody like you for so long.

As we get started here, how did this journey begin for you and how did it lead you to—

Elena: 8:24
—crochet? That’s a great question. So, fitness is my passion. I had a career in human resources for about eight years. And I would say about a year into it, I decided to get licensed to teach Zumba fitness. So that was sort of my first instructor opportunity in the fitness industry.

I really went with that for a while, and then slowly over the years, my interest just kept building and opportunities kept coming. So I learned to teach more fitness formats from there. Over time, I got certified as a fitness instructor through the American Council on Exercise, as well as the Athletics and Fitness Association of America. And then it led to getting certified as a personal trainer through AFA as well.

From there, I continued to build my community. I worked in a number of different gyms. But as my human resources career grew, it wasn’t as great for my schedule. A lot of facilities want you to teach at certain times, and it’s not really flexible. So I was in a position where I was having to give up classes—and that made me sad, because it was my outlet outside of my full-time job.

My passion for it just kept growing. Being able to reach a lot of people through that, I decided to start my own small business: Working It with Elena. I started renting space at a couple of local dance studios—started out with just one—to offer my Zumba classes. Then, as that grew and I got trained in other formats, I became a certified Tabata Bootcamp instructor, which is a small group training program.

That just grew as well. I already had somewhat of an audience from the Zumba classes, but then of course, there are people who want to focus more on healthy lifestyle choices and be held accountable for their workouts—identifying the right exercises, frequency, duration, intensity—plus the group camaraderie.

That’s when I started to feel like, okay, I want to maybe go full time with this or take a different look at what I’m doing. But it’s difficult in the industry, I would say, because working in HR full time—the pay is totally different from the fitness industry. It was a big pay cut I was looking at.

But I just felt like it was my passion. I was more passionate about it than HR and wanted to do what I could to get to my ultimate goal. Lots of conversations and brainstorming with my husband—because obviously that would impact our lives together as well.

And so from that point—and this is a random thing, I guess, but it relates to the story of how this whole journey came to be and where I am now—we decided to do something a bit unconventional: quit our jobs, leave Sacramento where we lived, and travel long term, indefinitely, with a backpack on a budget.

We saved for a while to be able to do that, put off homeownership and starting a family—decided it was important enough to us. My husband had traveled pretty extensively years ago, and I had barely traveled abroad. So it was something I felt like I wanted to do in my life.

We left in August 2016 and embarked on a 16-month journey. We got back December 2017, last year. We traveled across the US, went through Mexico and Central America over land, came home for a visit, flew to Thailand, spent some time there, then flew to Greece and Cyprus, spent some time in the UK.

I’m skipping over some places, but that’s just a general overview.

Brittany: 11:47
So cool.

Elena: 11:48
Thank you! We walked the Camino de Santiago in Spain, which was one of my life’s greatest challenges. Some people think very idealistically about that walk, but for those who don’t know, it’s about a 500-mile journey and trek across Spain with a backpack.

Physically, it was very challenging for me. I’m so proud and happy that we finished. But it was such a—life-changing journey. I know that sounds idealistic, but you learn a lot about yourself through struggling through physical challenges and the mental and emotional challenges that come along with it, in the elements, with such cool cultural exposure.

From there, we flew home and drove back across the US. Just a really neat experience—to immerse ourselves in different cultures around the world, different languages. Spanish was the primary language we studied while we were gone and immersed ourselves in. I studied a little bit of Greek while we were in Greece.

We did some house and pet sitting—so in those situations, we’d stay in a place for free in exchange for watching the person’s house and pets. Great way to save money and prolong the trip. We also taught English in Mexico and in Thailand for short periods.

And I was able to teach fitness classes while we were gone. One of the more “fancy” experiences on our budget travel was going to a resort in Oaxaca, Mexico, for a week in exchange for me teaching fitness classes twice a day. So I taught two Zumba classes a day there, met people from different countries. It was a cool experience and we got discounted rates for it.

That whole experience was about going for it—being comfortable with being uncomfortable. Living out of a backpack, not being fluent in the primary language, dealing with rough terrain and limited transportation options… all of it was just a really awesome journey.

And then one more thing I wanted to mention—being a Zumba instructor and having it so available around the world, it really was my in to meet locals in different places when I would seek out classes. Now I have a network of instructors I met along the way.

I didn’t know exactly what that was going to look like, but I did find a position that I’ve been in since February of this year—as the Health and Wellness Program Director for a local community center that also has a fitness center.

I oversee fitness instructors, personal trainers, and the programming—group fitness classes, small group training, personal training. And I get to teach and train myself, which is really cool.

And the latest thing about it that’s really neat is that I get to bring crochet there! We’re looking at community classes. I actually went through the Certified Instructors Program because of hearing about it on your podcast—among all the other amazing things I’ve received from your podcast in my crochet journey.

I’m almost done with that certification. I’m working on my teaching hours now and planning to start some community classes there—and then teach independently as well.

So going back to your question about the crochet journey piece: I started that in, I believe, March or April 2016—the year of our trip.

We need those things that feel like hobbies. Certainly, I still get that from the fitness industry, and I do—but I knew I needed a different hobby. Something that maybe wasn’t as active as my other hobby and career path.

I went to a crochet series class—three classes at a local yarn shop called Rumpelstiltskin in Midtown Sacramento. It was really great. I had a great experience there, learning from a woman who’d crocheted for years and years. She’s retired now, but at the time she taught me a lot and that sparked my journey.

As I traveled, I picked up a crochet hook and yarn whenever I could—especially toward the end of the trip when travel wasn’t as challenging, like when we were in the UK.

That’s when I found your podcast. I have really fond memories of crocheting a blanket that I later sent home to a friend’s daughter as a gift—working on that while we were house and pet sitting, and binge-listening to your episodes on public transportation, while crocheting that blanket.

So I’ve been an avid listener and fan. I’ve gotten so much out of your episodes, from you and your community. Thank you so much for all of that. It’s really priceless to me and has really helped me grow in my crochet craft and journey as a hobbyist.

Brittany: 18:28
Oh, wow. That’s so surreal to hear somebody say that. You don’t realize the impact that you have on somebody’s life until someone brings that to your attention.

And it’s—gosh, it’s just such a good reality check. Thank you. I appreciate that so much. It motivates me more than you know. So thank you.

Elena: 18:48
You’re welcome. Thank you. I’m just lucky to have found your podcast and community and continue to learn and grow from it every week.

It’s actually part of my self-care routine to take time out to crochet in my chair and just listen to your podcast. It’s very relaxing. And I also learn a lot from it.

Brittany: 19:07
Yeah, well, it’ll be a little interesting to hear yourself on this show, so I’m sure you’re looking forward to that.

Yeah, that’ll be great. It’ll be an interesting experience.

Well, let’s get to it, shall we? I’m just like chomping at the bit here to get into it.

The first thing that comes to mind for me is your place—the place where you sit and crochet. The place where, for me and other bloggers and designers who sit at a computer for long hours of the day—let’s run through your roadmap for setting up a good ergonomic workstation.

And let’s break it down between those who are just crocheting—that’s their hobby—and then maybe we can touch on the workstation part at a computer, because I know that’s really important too. There’s maybe some more hazards there than just sitting and crocheting. So I definitely want to cover both.

Yeah, that sounds great.

Elena: 20:04
So starting out with the crocheting piece, some of the things I’ll touch on are actually things that I’ve outlined to explain in the setting the ergonomic workstation at like a desk or a chair or computer. So it might help if I start with that and then move into the crochet piece, just because it might make more sense.

Totally. So starting out, it’s very important to set up an ergonomic workstation—and especially important if you are, for long, prolonged periods of time, seated at a desk or in a chair, or really wherever—crocheting or on a computer.

So there are different things that you can do to set yourself up properly. And we’ll start with the chair, since that’s the place that you’re going to be sitting.

So in that chair, you want to make sure that your feet are flat on the floor—not having your legs dangle, in other words. Your shoulders are down and back. You can get into that position by rolling your shoulders upwards toward your ears, and then pressing them down away from your ears and back.

And of course, the position that you put yourself in that way—you’re very intentionally bringing your shoulders down—they’re going to rise up a little bit as you’re seated there, but that’s okay.

Appropriate lumbar support—making sure your back is supported in that chair. Your armrests—making sure that they’re at the correct height. So this means they shouldn’t cause your shoulders to raise up toward your ears because you’re raising your forearms to sit on top of those armrests, if that makes sense.

There are chairs out there that are specifically advertised and described as ergonomic chairs, or chairs that are adjustable. I think an adjustable chair is a really great thing to have because you can adjust the armrests, the seat pan, the lumbar support, and the height of the chair.

All things that are important—because every body is different. Working in a standard chair, which I’ve tried before, didn’t work for me. I experienced pain and discomfort and needed to do something about that, which included getting a chair that was adjustable in that way.

Brittany: 22:25
Yeah. Well, that’s good to know that you like the ergonomic chair. I can’t even tell you how many hours I have spent browsing Amazon and reviews and watching YouTube videos about what is the best chair to get.

And I’m willing to spend money on it if I’m sitting in it eight hours a day—sometimes, I hate to admit, but sometimes more than that. Right now I am in one of those just standard chairs, and I think it fits me well. I’m definitely a shorter person, and I always ran into the issue of having the seat too long and not allowing me to either sit back in it or have my feet touch the floor.

So I’m in a chair that fits my petite little body now, but oh my gosh—it’s just so hard. I feel like my hips start to ache after sitting in it for so long, and I don’t know if it’s a padding issue or if it’s a sizing issue, but I am ready to send this chair on its new journey. It’s not really cutting it for me.

Elena: 23:29
Yeah, I think it depends, too. We all have different tastes in chairs and different comforts in chairs. So just because it says it’s an ergonomic chair doesn’t necessarily mean it’s going to be the right fit for you.

I think sometimes you might have to try different chairs, and I guess that’s hard to do if you’re ordering online. But if you can find certain types of chairs in stores to just go sit in a bunch of them and adjust them and kind of see how that feels, then I would recommend doing that.

Because it is not a cheap purchase necessarily, but can definitely be something that you’re going to be with for a lot of hours in the day every day. So you want to be comfortable in that chair, and I think it’s worth the investment. Your body will thank you.

But another thing to touch on too—and we’ll get into this in the episode a little bit more—is that the discomfort and pain in the hips might actually be from sitting for long periods of time. So regardless of the type of chair you have, it’s important to take regular breaks to get up and walk around, to stretch, those types of things. That can also help alleviate the situation.

Brittany: 24:39
Yeah. Yeah. Well, we’ll definitely get there, like you said, because I know I’m not the only one who’s not disciplined enough to get up and walk away from my work.

So, okay. So we’ve got a good understanding of the chair. What about the desk?

Elena: 24:55
For the desk, the main thing is the height that you’re looking at. This will affect some of the things I just mentioned about the chair, such as how I mentioned the feet should be flat on the floor.

Well, you want to raise your chair so that your forearms are parallel to the desk. And if that means your feet aren’t flat on the floor, then a footrest is recommended so your feet can go flat on that.

This also means that to adjust yourself to the desk height, it might present a need to adjust other items at your workstation accordingly—things that maybe were positioned in a great spot when your feet were flat on the floor in your chair but didn’t take into account the desk height.

So I would start with getting your forearms parallel to the desk and making sure you have a footrest there. Footrests are pretty cheap, and if you don’t buy an actual footrest, you can really just put books or other items under your feet.

Some footrests—and I like this—are angled so you can adjust the tilt, which is another benefit. That helps take into account your desk height as well.

Brittany: 26:05
Okay. Real quick question for you. How do you feel about standing desks?

Elena: 26:11
That’s a great question. I have a resource in the show notes from UC Davis, and they actually outline benefits and drawbacks to that type of workstation.

I think they can be quite expensive, and they can be a benefit—but only if you’re using them appropriately. Something I thought was interesting in the UC Davis study was that the people they looked into actually ended up sitting most of the time at their standing workstation—on a stool or chair that goes with it.

So I thought that was interesting—that the intent was to try to stand more, but they ended up leaning.

Brittany: 26:48
Yeah. But they’re leaning.

Elena: 26:49
Yeah, exactly. So there’s that. But aside from that, my husband actually uses a standing workstation that moves into a sitting one. That’s great in terms of flexibility, but there are drawbacks to standing all day as well.

Your weight can be shifted unevenly across your body, which can create muscle imbalances over time—especially if you favor one side when you lean. So that’s a potential drawback.

You also want to make sure you have the right padding and shoes underneath to support your body for prolonged periods. So I think the best thing really, if you have one of those workstations, is just being mindful of how much time you’re standing and how much time you’re sitting.

Research shows that the combination is what’s most beneficial.

Brittany: 27:47
Okay. Good to know. Good to know. Is there anything else that we need to know about the desk and that setup?

Elena: 27:53
Yeah. So with the desk setup, there are obviously things you have on your desk. That’s the next sort of section I want to touch on. Once you have your desk height figured out and you’ve set up your chair for that height, what do you do from there?

How do you make sure everything on your desk is in the right ergonomic position?

Brittany: 28:16
Yeah, that makes sense. So I’m thinking monitors, keyboards, mouse—those sorts of things?

Elena: 28:24
Absolutely. You’ve got it.

The first thing is the computer screen, if you’re working with a computer. The distance from your screen should be just beyond your fingertips when your arms are outstretched.

I’ve found in doing ergonomic assessments—professionally in my HR role or even in my current role—that most people have their screen too far away and need to bring it closer. It can feel awkward at first, but the eye distance really impacts how much you’re straining or squinting.

So move it just beyond your outstretched fingertips—that’s the ideal ergonomic position.

You can also adjust your computer settings to increase font size and display scale, which helps. Then, monitor height: it should be just below your eyebrows. You should be scanning down with your eyes—not moving your head and neck up and down.

I notice a lot of people have their monitors too high, which puts a lot of strain on the neck and upper back. If it’s too low, same thing. Some monitors adjust up and down. Others don’t, so you may need monitor risers.

They’re pretty inexpensive—around $10–$20—or you can stack books or paper as a workaround.

Now, I know a lot of people use laptops and maybe don’t have external monitors. If you’re primarily using a laptop, I would strongly recommend using external monitors and a keyboard/mouse setup.

It’s really hard to create an ergonomic desk setup with just a laptop. You can’t separate the keyboard from the screen. So you might raise the laptop up to get the screen at the right height, but then you’re stuck typing at a weird angle.

That actually happened to me in my current role. When I first started, I had a laptop and no risers or monitors. I stacked reams of paper under it as a temporary fix, but eventually made the case for investing in proper equipment. It was worth it.

If external monitors aren’t an option, consider getting a stand that tilts the laptop screen and keyboard to better angles. But even then, I would still recommend using a separate keyboard and mouse.

The laptop keys are narrower, and the built-in mouse pad can be awkward. Using your whole hand for a mouse is much better ergonomically than using just your finger on the trackpad.

So overall, if you can swing it, I’d recommend going with external monitors and a traditional keyboard and mouse setup.

Brittany: 33:10
Okay. Yeah, that all makes sense. I know I went to an ergonomic keyboard too. I was using just a standard keyboard. I know I’m notorious for letting my wrist sag when I use the mouse and when I sit and type, which I do a lot of.

So I found a keyboard that—oh, it was so hard to get used to typing on it—but I really can’t use anything else other than this keyboard. It’s sort of raised up in the middle, but it’s also separated between the Y and the T key. Like there’s some separation there, and it does have a nice wrist rest, so that when I do have my tendency of sagging my wrist, at least I’ve got a little bit of support there.

But then I also went to one of those—I found this mouse that was vertical, and I could get how it would work. And so I thought, well, I’ll give it a try. I know I was having some problem again because my wrist was sagging, so that bone that’s sort of at the heel of your hand, like below your pinky, that would just ache and it would be red.

And no matter how hard I tried, I couldn’t get my wrist off of the desk. So I tried this new mouse and it worked for a while. It was really hard to get used to, but I still felt like I had issues. Like it really just went from the side of that bone that I was constantly putting pressure on rather than directly on my wrist where all those tendons and nerves come through.

And so I’m not using that mouse anymore, but I will definitely link to both of those in the show notes if anybody wants to check out the keyboard. I stand behind it 100%. It’s a Microsoft keyboard. I think I spent, I don’t know, 60 or 70 bucks on it. It was totally worth it.

The mouse really wasn’t for me, but I’ll link to it just in case somebody wants to give it a try. It was interesting. I’ve still thought about going back to it. It’s just so hard to get used to holding your hand in a completely different position.

Elena: 35:21
Yeah, I haven’t regularly used any of those. So I haven’t used an ergonomic keyboard like the one that you were using, and I also haven’t regularly used an ergonomic mouse that’s in a different position. So I’m glad you shared your experience with that with your audience—I think that’s very valuable.

And going back to every person—just because something’s ergonomic doesn’t necessarily mean it’s a good fit for every person in that exact model. So yeah, sometimes it might take some trial and error to figure out what works for you.

But generally with keyboarding and mousing—even if you have just a regular keyboard and a regular mouse—just a couple of tips for people on that. So we want to make sure—you mentioned kind of planting your wrist into the rests that are on those things—we want to make sure we’re trying to keep a neutral wrist when we’re mousing as well as when we’re typing.

So even though those wrist rests are there, we don’t want to really press into them. We want to be mindful about really keeping that neutral position to kind of avoid and alleviate some of that discomfort or pain that comes from having that for a prolonged period of time repetitively.

And then with the keyboard, I noticed that about half the people whose workstations I’ve looked at have their feet up on their keyboard—you know, the little peg thing on the back?

Brittany: 37:17
Yeah.

Elena: 37:18
And actually, that is not an ergonomic position. So it’s interesting to me that so many keyboards come with that, because what happens is you end up moving your wrist into a non-neutral position. Usually, you’re tilting your hand upwards.

And so in order to keep a neutral wrist and neutral hands, you want those feet down. Again, your wrist is staying in a neutral position. I know that can feel a bit awkward as an adjustment for some people because they’re used to having those feet up, but really it’s the best position that you can have your hands in when typing.

Brittany: 37:24
Makes sense. I can definitely speak from personal experience of the discomfort that that causes over time.

I didn’t really spend a whole lot of time on the computer before I went full time with BeHooked. And I thought, I’m really young, I’m flexible, I’m healthy—I don’t have to worry about any of this. Sort of like the “I’m invincible” attitude.

And gosh, what a reality check I’ve had in the last year just realizing that—wow, over time, and it’s not a long period of time either—some of these things that we sort of dismiss, or that I certainly dismissed, can really catch up to you. And it can affect you and your hobby.

So whether you crochet, or whether you have a crochet career, or if you’re in that demographic of person who works at a desk for their job—it’s going to impact your hobby and knitting and crochet. And there’s really only one way around that, and that’s to be conscious of these things.

Elena: 38:35
Absolutely. I agree. So what can we do as crocheters? Is that kind of where you were thinking about heading now, or is there anything else we haven’t covered?

Brittany: 38:42
Yeah.

Elena: 38:42
So one last thing—and this is whether you’re at a computer or whether you’re crocheting—would be taking eye breaks. Our eyes can get very fatigued.

And I know personally that I’m focused on what I’m doing, I’m not really thinking about giving my eyes a rest, but it really does make a difference. So the recommendation is a 20-20-20 rule: for every 20 minutes or so, look about 20 feet away for 20 seconds to help prevent eye fatigue.

So whether you’re at a computer workstation or whether you’re looking at the close details in your crochet work, taking that break is so important to prevent that fatigue.

And then on a note with crocheting, proper lighting is also important so you’re not straining your eyes. Because if it’s too dark, we’re really having to focus in.

Personally, sometimes when I’m crocheting, it’s changing from daylight into the evening and I might not always notice when that’s happening—until it feels like, oh man, my eyes are tired for some reason. And then I realize, oh, well, it’s dark now. I need to turn on a light.

So I actually recently purchased—I guess it’s a book light, but it also could be used for the details of crocheting or whatever craft you’re doing. I like it because it clips on and has three settings. It’s an LED light.

That has really helped me when crocheting in the evening casually while watching TV or listening to a podcast. It’s in my setting where I’m normally working on my crochet projects, and it makes it more comfortable for me. That’s just a little tip there—the lighting.

Brittany: 40:21
Yeah, I think that’s another thing that people don’t really think about too. I am certainly guilty of crocheting with just the light of the TV and maybe a small lamp.

And yeah, I get to the point where I have one of two options: I can sit there and strain my eyes, or I just sort of crochet by feel and not look at my work as much as I should. And that leads to potential problems. So yeah, I think getting a lamp like that would be a great option for somebody.

Elena: 40:51
Absolutely. And I like that you can angle it too, because it is like a book lamp, right? So you can manipulate the—I don’t want to say cord—but like the headpiece to where you want it exactly to go and focus. I thought that was really helpful as well.

And it was like 20 bucks or something like that on Amazon—not an expensive purchase.

Brittany: 41:12
Okay. Yeah, definitely worth looking into. Yeah. So you said there were a lot of similarities with how somebody should sit at their desk workstation and how somebody should sit when they’re crocheting.

Can you share what the greatest position is and how we can be mindful of how we’re sitting while we’re trying to relax?

Elena: 41:34
Yes. So specific to crochet—I’m sure some people crochet at a desk, and some people crochet in chairs and other different ways as well.

So I would say with the workstation—and even if you’re sitting in a chair and not at a desk crocheting—the same guidelines apply with the arms. So if you are using armrests, or in some cases, pillows maybe, if you’re seated at maybe a recliner chair or a regular chair or couch or something, you should always make sure that your shoulders are down and away from your ears and not raised up.

So similar with the armrests to the pillows—if those pillows make your arms come up and your shoulders rise, then that’s not the best position to be crocheting in.

I’ve played with this a little bit myself. I sit in a chair and there are armrests, but I actually find most of the time that I don’t want to use my armrests because I do sometimes feel that slight raising. And again, it’s very slight—it’s not a big thing that’s super noticeable—but my shoulders do tend to get tired when I rest my arms on those armrests versus if I just let them hang to my sides in my chair and crochet with my work.

Brittany: 42:46
Yeah, I really didn’t put much thought into how your shoulders are impacted as far as knitting and crocheting goes. And that was really the first thing that I said to my physical therapist.

He asked me what I do for my job, and so I explained that I would say probably 60% of the time I am on the computer and the other 40% of the time I am sitting somewhere in a more comfortable chair on the couch and knitting and crocheting.

And I remember saying to him, but I don’t really think I use my shoulders that much while I’m knitting or crocheting. And he was like, you would be surprised at how much you really do use them. And he wasn’t surprised if that was the culprit.

I think for me, it was a combination of a lot of bad behaviors or a lot of bad habits that I have formed over the years. And let me just say—it’s really hard to work yourself out of those.

So being aware of your shoulders—if anyone listening has had that experience of what it feels like to have a shoulder problem, whether that be like a rotator cuff issue or frozen shoulder or there are any number of things that can go wrong—you know how difficult it is.

It’s like when you throw your back out. You don’t realize how much you use your back until you can’t. Well, your shoulders are kind of the same way. It really does prevent you from doing what you love, from doing your hobby. If your shoulders ache, you feel it when you knit or when you crochet.

Absolutely. So we need to keep them in a neutral position. Now for me, I know it’s really difficult to hold my shoulders back. I have to constantly think about it. I have to make myself hold my shoulders back.

I don’t so much have the issue of raising them up. Mine totally roll forward. And my physical therapist—my doctor—called me out on that. He was like, I know exactly what your problem is. You’re too young for all of these issues, but you have really bad posture.

After that initial consult, going home and thinking, okay, so I need to stand here. I need to roll my shoulders back. And as I’m doing it, I’m holding with my muscles. And after a while, my shoulder muscles are like, hey, give us a break.

But when I do, they would roll forward. And I’m like, no, I can’t do that because that’s causing the problem. And then even when I try to hold my shoulders back and open my chest, it’s harder for me to breathe.

So I feel like it’s just a whole world of problems that’s going on as a result of posture. And I can’t help but think that it originated from just bad habits of sitting on the couch and not thinking about whether I’m hunched forward or whether my arms are at the right height and that sort of thing.

Elena: 45:42
Absolutely. I think that’s a very common experience that people have, whether they’re working on a craft or working on their day job at a desk. Having that sort of rounded tendency of the shoulders is definitely something I think that’s common in our society. So I actually—in our next section about stretching—I’m going to address all of that, about stretching and strengthening the muscles that we’re targeting that kind of have that piece. So stay tuned in a couple minutes.

Brittany: 46:14
I’m excited for that. I sort of jumped the gun on that one.

Elena: 46:17
That’s okay. I’m glad you did. It’s a great segue.

Brittany: 46:20
Yeah. So is there anything else that we need to keep in mind when we’re sitting—like I said, trying to relax? For me, that means not worrying about these things. Is there a way to make that more of a natural thing, like something that we automatically do versus something that we have to sit down and say, okay, I’ve got to figure out how I can sit here comfortably yet ergonomically so that I’m not hurting myself in the process?

Elena: 46:48
Yeah, I can speak from personal experience on that. It might feel awkward at first because it’s not something that you’re used to. And when starting any new habit, it’s not natural sometimes. But I think over time, as you practice these habits and get in the mindset before you’re setting yourself up to work—and as you’re reminding yourself through while you’re working—it does become kind of like second nature.

So I had to do the same thing when I started in my chair crocheting in the evening and figuring out what was working, what wasn’t working. And I kind of feel like I have it down for myself now. But it definitely takes time, and you’ll have to remind yourself as you’re working sometimes about the position that you’re sitting.

Especially when—the best reminder, I think—is when we start to feel that discomfort and start to think, okay, wait a second, why am I feeling this? What can I do to adjust that quickly?

So I do have one more thing, actually, on that topic of when you’re crocheting and you’re trying to relax—however you’re seated—you want to make sure you’re looking straight ahead so that your head and neck are in neutral positions.

Just like I explained with the monitor screen—that you want to be looking ahead, scanning down your document or whatever’s on your screen—when you’re crocheting, you also want to be looking straight ahead and then looking down with your eyes only at your project.

This can work even in a recliner. I crochet in a recliner when I’m relaxing myself. And actually, I feel like it helps bring me into that position a little bit easier than if I were just seated in a normal chair. But I’ve practiced this while on a plane—in an awkward kind of chair, as most people feel like when they’re on a plane—but also in my recliner position.

And I’ve noticed that I don’t have discomfort in my neck or in my upper shoulders or back when I’m practicing this. And as I mentioned on a number of these things, it does feel awkward at first because you are not used to doing it that way. And you think, how can I train myself to do this? This feels so weird. But you would be surprised over time what a difference it really makes.

So yeah—just looking straight ahead, neutral head and neck, and then looking down with your eyes only.

Brittany: 48:58
Okay. I’m glad you brought up the recliner too, because that was something that came up in that initial Instagram post that I made before I released that first episode. There are a lot of people out there who do have some back problems that prevent them from being able to sit upright.

So it’s good to know that we can still get our body in a good neutral position in a recliner too. Because for me, that almost seems counterintuitive—like because my feet aren’t on the floor, then I can’t get everything else in order. But it’s good to know that that’s not the case.

Elena: 49:35
Yeah, I wouldn’t say it’s the best ergonomic position compared to other positions that you can be in. And I personally have not done a lot of research about working long periods in a recliner chair, so I don’t want to speak too much on that particular topic.

But I will say, just from my own experience of crocheting in a recliner for like an hour at a time or so, I have found these tips sort of helpful about how to best set myself up in that particular type of chair—so with the arm raising or not, with the armrest or not, and then looking straight ahead and scanning down my work.

Brittany: 50:12
Yeah, that makes sense. Now, I definitely do want to spend a lot of time on the stretches and strength training because I know that that’s a very important piece of the puzzle. So… let’s move into that. And I know you have so much to speak on as far as that goes.

Elena: 50:31
Yeah, absolutely. So I think a good place to start generally just on this topic is that we want to identify exercises and stretches that strengthen and/or lengthen our targeted muscle groups. So generally speaking, we need to strengthen weaker muscles and stretch tighter muscles—which intuitively makes sense, right?

Brittany: 50:51
Yeah.

Elena: 50:51
So common tight muscles—which is where we’ll start—are hips, the hamstrings (which are in the back of the leg, the upper back leg), the chest, and in front of the shoulders due to prolonged sitting and working at a computer—or even not on a computer, but on detailed items we focus on intently, such as our crochet work.

So Brittany, you mentioned the rounded shoulders look that kind of naturally happens for a lot of people over time. This is definitely a cause of that—looking intently at our work. And so a stretching routine is really important.

And before getting too far into stretching, I just also want to say that taking breaks from what you’re doing is equally important as stretching. So if you’re sitting for prolonged periods of time, maybe that means every half an hour or every hour you just get up and stand up and walk around the room—or go out for a walk or something like that—just to kind of break up the sitting and standing.

But you can also incorporate stretching into that routine. Just as a general guideline, you want to hold each stretch for about three to five breaths or 15 to 30 seconds per stretch. Now you can do this in between rounds or rows or again, as little as every 15 to 20 minutes.

Whatever timeline you choose is totally up to you and what works with you. But you want to make sure that you’re mindfully thinking about taking those breaks. And that, again, also helps with the eye fatigue piece that we talked about as well and not being in a static position for too long while seated.

Brittany: 52:28
Yeah. Okay. So I know that I am definitely not great at taking breaks. I lose track of time, to be quite honest. And I know a lot of people are in that position too.

One of the things that I have tried using that has really, really helped me—I mentioned it in that previous episode, but just in case you didn’t hear that one, I want to mention it one more time—there’s an app called Tide, and it’s basically just a timer. I mean, it does many things. It has like a focus section and sleep section, so you can actually record your sleep and that sort of thing.

But I use it primarily for focus. And you can set it for 20 minutes, 15, 30—however many minutes you want to be focused. And that was a good reminder for me that, okay, I need to put it down for just a couple minutes, maybe get up, walk around, do whatever. And so that was a really big help for me as far as losing track of time.

Elena: 53:27
I love that tip. I think that’s great and would be a recommendation for me as well—that if you lose track of time or it’s hard for you to remember to get up and move or get up and stretch and take a break, then absolutely setting a timer for that mindfulness is a great tip.

And something that just came to mind as you were saying that—I know that they do make activity trackers, like a Fitbit for example, that do a multitude of things. But specifically what I thought of when you were talking, Brittany, is that there is at least one model I know of that, if you’re wearing a wrist one—a wrist Fitbit, for example—it does buzz you when you’ve been sitting for too long.

Now, I haven’t used this one myself, but I’ve had friends that have used it and have explained sort of how that piece works. And it was effective for them because it’s an automatic reminder of, oh, I need to get up and move now.

Brittany: 54:18
Yeah, I can speak from personal experience on this one. I’m sure if anybody has seen any of my videos, you’ve seen my Fitbit. I’ve worn it for—now granted, I’ve had different Fitbits over the years—but for the last five or six years, I have had some kind of Fitbit on my arm.

Right now, I have the Alta HR. And this particular one does do what you were saying. You can set it up through the app so it doesn’t have to buzz you if you don’t want it to. But it will let you know if you’ve been sitting for too long. And it’s just two really short buzzes.

Sometimes you may have actually heard that in one of my videos because it’s a little difficult to edit out some of that vibrating noise, but it’s minor. It’s not anything crazy. It’s not an alarm bell or anything like that, but it is a nice little gentle reminder that, hey, you’ve been sitting for too long—let’s get up and move.

Elena: 55:14
Great. Yeah, I think that’s great that you’ve had experience with that and can speak to that and recommend it as well.

Brittany: 55:21
Yeah, I love my Fitbit. Gosh, I don’t know where I would be without it. I love the sleep tracking that this one does—because it is the HR model, it does record the heart rate, and so I get some sleep insights. And that has helped me really just improve my sleep.

It’s helped me with getting up and moving around. There’s even like a water thing—which I’m not super great at remembering to drink enough water throughout the day. So it really has helped me a ton. I just love my Fitbit.

Awesome. Yeah, I think it’s a great tool. So what else about stretching?

Elena: 55:58
Yeah, so I did create a blog post that we’ll link to in the show notes that illustrates and describes a number of stretches that I think are applicable for crocheters and just the general population as well.

Specifically: the wrists and the forearms, shoulders, neck, upper back, chest, and then moving down to the lower body—the hamstrings, the glutes, the hips, the quads. On the blog post, I do have photos and descriptions for each one, as well as I recorded a guided stretching video that’s like five to seven minutes in length for your audience.

So I hope that that is helpful for maybe anybody who is not sure really what stretches to do or what parts of the body to address in a…

Brittany: 56:47
Yeah, that is wonderful because those are the types of things that we can’t really discuss here on audio, but it’s great to have that resource for people to go to—to either see a photo or, even better, watch the video. So I’ll have that linked in the show notes. Definitely check that out at the end of the episode.

Elena: 57:03
Awesome. And then, other things regarding stretching—you can utilize tools to help you with stretching. For example, there are straps out there. You may have seen them used in yoga commonly.

There’s resistance bands, yoga blocks, foam rollers—and these are all to enhance your experience with stretching. So just one example: if you’re reaching towards your toes while you’re seated and your legs and arms are extended mostly straight, if you can’t touch your toes or get close to them, if you wrap a strap or resistance band around your feet and then hold on to the ends, that enhances your stretch and makes that stretch more accessible to you.

Brittany: 57:43
Okay, that makes sense. Yeah, I’m thinking about that now and I can’t reach my toes. I’ll just be honest. I stretch every day and I haven’t reached that milestone yet.

Elena: 57:53
So maybe the strap could be a great tool to help you kind of get there. And you can walk your hands down the strap towards your feet a little bit more as you’re feeling more comfortable and like you’re getting closer.

Brittany: 58:06
Yeah. Okay, cool. I’ll definitely have to try that. I do have some of those resistance bands, I guess. It’s not like the rope—it’s not the one that you buy in the store—it’s what you get at the physical therapist. So they’re basically like big, thick rubber bands that I do some stretches with. So I’ll have to use those for stretching too. I’ve just been using those really for like strength training.

Elena: 58:28
Yeah, I think that could be great for stretching as well—similarly to how a strap could be used.

Brittany: 58:34
Yeah, that makes sense. Okay. And then a yoga block—I mentioned. So one thing that could be helpful with this is if you are standing up and you’re hinging at your hips and trying to touch your toes or touch the ground or something, if you set up the yoga block—maybe your goal is to touch that yoga block instead—and you can press into that block and then stretch the back of the legs that way. So that would enhance that stretch for somebody who maybe can’t reach their toes or get close to it.

Brittany: 59:02
I’m curious, what do you think the most important stretches for somebody who is crocheting for long periods of time? Is it the wrists? Is it the hips? Because they’ve probably been sitting for so long. Like if somebody could just do one stretch—and that was them getting into the habit of stretching—is there one stretch that’s more important?